Is it legal to download music from Pandora...

Fsman · 04-26-08, 09:10 AM

...using software like Orbit?
When is downloading music illegal?

**radimus** · 04-26-08, 09:33 AM

when you do not pay for it...

Julie · 04-26-08, 01:59 PM

Pandora seems to be very interested in protecting the rights of the artists and compensating them for the use of their music. Pandora also makes it very easy to purchase music that you like.

If you read through Pandora's terms of use, you'll see that downloading music to another device without paying for it clearly violates the terms of use.

Fsman · 04-26-08, 04:52 PM

So the activity discussed in post #15 of the thread below is illegal?

http://www.aximsite.com/boards/multi...8-pandora.html

Julie · 04-26-08, 07:11 PM

Yeah, I'd say what the poster is proposing is illegal.

Fsman · 04-26-08, 07:48 PM

Thanks...I wanted a definitive answer.

spunker88 · 04-26-08, 07:49 PM

If you can get for free on the internet any content like music, video, etc that can be bought somewhere else, then its classified as "illegal".

Its up to you if you want to pay for it or not, but I doubt you can discuss that type of stuff here.

**hyedipin** · 04-26-08, 08:52 PM

It is a touchy subject, but remember, recording something using analog techniques such as recording the song in real time while listening to it, is not illegal. I am not sure how Orbit works, but it looks like Pandora already stores those songs on your computer during buffering, therefore this Orbit thing might just take advantage of it and keep those songs in your computer. If pandora uses your computer's hard drive space (in temp folder), I don't see why you can't keep those songs..

DaLabrador · 04-26-08, 09:16 PM

The renaming of the files is probably some kind of "copy protection"(cheap developing costs ftw!), and circumventing those is illegal in some countries (even for personal use).

If it's illegal or not depends on if the record company and/or artist has allowed their music to be distributed that way, so it's not quite as easy as "if I pay for it it's legal", although the crime may only be committed on the seller's side(again with the country laws).

Julie · 04-26-08, 09:43 PM

Quoting from Pandora's Terms of Use, which everyone who signs up for it must agree to:

Quote:

You can't use Pandora to steal music, and you have to listen to it through pandora.com or on a device officially supported by Pandora

and here:

Quote:

You agree that you will not:

3.1 use the Pandora Services to reproduce copyrighted materials;

3.2 copy, store, edit, change, prepare any derivative work of or alter in any way any of the tracks streamed through the Pandora Services;

So what do you think? Does it violate the terms of use or not? It seems pretty clear to me that it does.

DaLabrador · 04-26-08, 10:34 PM

It definitely violates the terms of use. I know of at least a couple of countries where terms of use agreements in the form of checkboxes or similar aren't legally binding, though. :)
If they were disclaimers would work, and they don't(not in all cases).

I don't know, but I believe circumventing copy protection is worse than violating terms of use (which in my honest opinion sometimes is something to strive for, since it can force progress in some areas). What they do is similar to putting a glass of water in front of a thirsty person telling it not to drink.

You are of course right (although the legality part depends on where pandora got their material). I'm just speculating.

Kenster · 04-28-08, 08:13 PM

Not trying to be contrarian, but
While it is pretty clear that capturing the audio stream for playback later violates the terms of use,
the original listener may have just wanted to LISTEN to the stream without saving it. That is, after all, the service that Pandora provides.

Julie · 04-28-08, 11:21 PM

Sure...I don't think anyone here has a concern about the original discussion in that thread. It is the posting by the person who proposed a way to harvest the files as they are being played that we take issue with. Harvesting the files and saving them as mp3 files is equivalent to downloading copywritten songs without paying for them, which violates Pandora's terms of use and essentially results in downloading music illegally.

bobthegoat2001 · 04-29-08, 01:41 AM

I'm sure it is illegal to download them, but I just wish there was a way to actually use Pandora.com on my Axim (or any PDA for the matter) 100% legally. I'd rather do it that way, but alas there's no other way currently to do that. It's actually a hassle to have to download the songs and rename them so that I can listen to them while at work, which has Wifi. I don't keep the MP3's, I just listen to them to see if I like the artist and I'll actually buy the CD if I do (just like the way Pandora is intended to be set up).

I'll delete my post in that thread if you want me to.

spunker88 · 04-29-08, 06:45 AM

Originally Posted by hyedipin

It is a touchy subject, but remember, recording something using analog techniques such as recording the song in real time while listening to it, is not illegal. I am not sure how Orbit works, but it looks like Pandora already stores those songs on your computer during buffering, therefore this Orbit thing might just take advantage of it and keep those songs in your computer. If pandora uses your computer's hard drive space (in temp folder), I don't see why you can't keep those songs..

So, back in the days of tapes, you could pop a tape in and record that song off the radio, and that was legal?