A thread about nothing....

[wmrawls]

Nice to have this type of discussion without a lot of name calling and other harder to spell things. (most here know that my spelling is atrociouse, atrocious, atrosiso, oh heck really bad.)
I was born and rasied a Cathloic, became and athetis while in Viet Nam, graduated to agnostic and now I am a Baptist. I like to think I combine a lot of view points in my thinking but then I am prejudice towards myself. I am stricly a NEW Testamnet believer. I go to church and Sunday school and work with kids and the aged. I enjoy the peace that church brings to me. It is, admitidly, easier for me to believe in Jesus then in GOD. Sounds wierd I know. I think about all the idiots that are doing things to thier fellow humans, the wrongs done to animals and the planet and I get really discouraged in thinking that somewhere there is a GOD that lets it all go on. I really hate it when people of any following invoke GOD as the driving force behind thier actions, good or bad. I hate the term "Gods will", becasue I don't think there is a "will" behind many of the things that go on. For everyone that claims God interceeded in thier lives there are many more that dont have that intervention, for everyone that claims an ANGEL saved them or touched them I ask where are the angels that are suppose to protect the others that surffer terribly.
So I think there is an after life, weather there is a GOD in control I dont really know. But the Christian life style is good for me and I have rasied my kids to believe that there are good people and that GOD, if he exists, wants us to help ourselves and to help others when we can.
What happens when I die, well I don't think I will, the body will go (and some days the sooner the better) but I am to arrogant to think my spirit will just wither up and blow away. So maybe I will have to look at GOD someday and admit I was wrong, I'll take that chance. In the mean time I help out when I can, feed stray animals, hug every lady that I can, young or old, fat or then, pretty or not....do the little things that make this world a better place.
Talk is easy, doing is hard, tearing down takes almost no effort, building takes all you got.
Have a lovely life and cherish it will you can.
Nuff Said,
Line up to the right for hugs, fanny pats are optional. End of the line Star50....end of the line.

[Jwilker]

Originally posted by hnelson59
think i am at the duck-billed platypus stage

Man it took me years to get to Koala!! How far is Platypus? I don't have to be a lemur first do I.

It's funny jeepfaned, I say the same thing about god and heaven (being something to grasp in the absense of understanding). Funny that both "camps" have very similar ideas but at the same time opposite.

I don't mean religious folks don't understand anything (it kinda reads that way) but I do think that finding religion helps many feel more important. The universe is a very very big place. I think many take comfort in thinking somebody created it and is watching over them.

I find it ironic that those who start the discussion vehemently opposed to even the idea of God usually try to discredit Christianity by quoting the Old Testament.

I think that is usually used to point out flaws in the system. I'm no theologian but isn't the old testiment part of the bible? Or do we not believe in that part, only the part we like? It goes to point out the (used very loosely) falability of the document and it's writers. I think that's the case anyway. It wasn't my tactic, though I have used it before

[Jwilker]

Well said wmrawls, well said.

Haey star50, he's handing out hugs, get off me!

[geneb]

Originally posted by Xyress
Ahh! The Bible is true because the Bible says so? Why didn't anybody tell me this before?!

The power and PRESENCE of the Holy Spirit is the difference between true Christianity and all other religions.

Please read the entire post before making sarcastic comments.

[Jwilker]

Originally posted by geneb
The power and PRESENCE of the Holy Spirit is the difference between true Christianity and all other religions.

So the others are wrong? I'm curious what true Christianity is.

[geneb]

Christianity means Christ-like.

"A disciple, when he is fully taught, is like his master"

Therefore, to be a true Christian one must be a disciple of the Lord Jesus, not just a pew-warmer in a "Christian" church.

It's not easy, and I fall short in many ways, but I continue to try and learn. Of course, when I do fail I ask for the Lord's forgiveness and grace to get up and go forward.

Just like when someone here inadvertently insults someone else, we ask for forgiveness and go forward in a sense of community and friendship, rather than letting things get out of hand.

That said, if I have insulted someone it was not intentional. I apologize for being insensitive to others views. Shall we go on with the discussion peacefully?

[jeepfaned]

wilker...very good point up there..it is funny how similar it is..only on other sides of the coin. reading all these posts in these threads...1 thing remains the same and most obvious...
we all have more questions then answers..but then if we had the answers..we wouldnt need to ask the questions and then no one would learn more...i guess this is the way its spose to be..to ask is to show we want to learn.

star..u lining up for a hug..or a "pat"...or both??

[Jwilker]

Not insulted here. I think we're doing pretty darn good at staying civil.

So that's interesting. A "pew warmer" or "luke warm" isn't gonna cut it? In your view.

THat's one of the things I find most interesting. The wide range or views even within fairly similar groups. I would imagine a great many "pew warmers" (very funny term BTW) would be none to thrilled by this idea that they aren't gonna make the cut.

Kinda like the guy that gets agro on the free way and purposefully cuts you off or won't let you in, but has a school of Jesus fish on his bumper.

[jeepfaned]

urrrrr...this is ironic..not to switch gears here,but this just chaps my hide...i work in (and dont lash out at me) in collections..but hey!! im nice,i dont razz people or any crap like that,no yelling,threats or anything..anyway,i deal with all kinds of people everyday. so,like what just happened a few mins ago..i call a lady and she throws the old line at me that has been used SO many times.."i put my bills in Gods hands,he will provide for me" rrrgggg
that makes me so mad...God helps those who help themselves..in my book..i hate when people use God as an excuse to get out of paying their bills...and funny,most times its preachers who do this!! i kid u not! i would think they would want to set an example for others!
so they use this as an excuse and say bless you,God help you for calling me..you need help...but yet IM the one with a job,trying to make an honest living,paying my bills..while the "holyer then thou" lady sits at home watchin oprah with 4 or 5 kids,on welfare,and living in a place that only cost her $50 a mth cuz she aint got no job and boo hoo,all the kids fathers left me with no child support,so she gets assisted living,and food stamps..that she sells for cash down the stree so she can buy smokes...believe me,it happens,and this is the type of lady that tells me I need God!!
those are the people who chap my @$$ big time!!
whew..ok..i vented....sorry!!

[Jwilker]

I used to work at a system integrator and we had a guy skip on his bill because he was unhappy with how long it took to get his machine (he kept changing specs) so he says his pastor said it was ok to not pay us. never saw a dime, of course he never gave the compute back.

[jeepfaned]

a pastor said that?? see,,that and the catholic preist or priest or what ever the guys are called who got in all the trouble..and are still getting in trouble for the abuse of children...that frys me too!!
and they try to bring more people "to the lite" and when you get all these storys in the press of being sexually abused...AT CHURCH!!! how sick is that??! the 1 place a person could feel at ease and safe...id like to...well..i wont say,its not my place to dish out punishment..just makes me mad!

[Howard2k]

So Jeepfan is saying that whether you're a good person or not, if you're not part of his religon you go to hell.

one thing that was told to me many years ago is.."good people dont go to heaven...saved people do"

So that include the rapist priests?

Geneb is saying that if you read his scripture (not his personally, but the scripture that he believes) you go to heaven. Otherwise you're hell bound.


Basically the message that I'm getting is that going to heaven is really nothing to do with being a good person or not. It's all about being in the club.


Anyway. I actually DO think that there is benefit in religion, in some situations. Life does suck sometimes and there are people out there that get a lot of "relief" from believing that there is light at the end of the tunnel.. I'm sure there are people that make friends through religion.

Not trying to belittle any religion (though some make it so much easier than others) but it's essentially a losing situation for most people. If not all.

Let's pretend for a second that there is a God. His name is Allah and all those who don't worship him will be damned. Most of us on this board and the large majority of the Western world lose. Game over.

Let's pretend that he's a 7th day adventist and all those not 7th day adventists are going to hell. ok, so most of the world loses.

Let's pretend there is not god and when we die we just die. The end. Game over. All those who thought they were going to heaven (or whatever their religion's flavour is) have lost.


Then we have those that insist that the word of the bible is "the word" but believe only the parts that they want to believe.

Personally I just don't understand. It seems like just some big global clique/cult to me. "Be a member of my club or go to hell".

[Howard2k]

Originally posted by jeepfaned
a pastor said that?? see,,that and the catholic preist or priest or what ever the guys are called who got in all the trouble..and are still getting in trouble for the abuse of children...that frys me too!!
and they try to bring more people "to the lite" and when you get all these storys in the press of being sexually abused...AT CHURCH!!! how sick is that??! the 1 place a person could feel at ease and safe...id like to...well..i wont say,its not my place to dish out punishment..just makes me mad!

But these people still deserve to be forgiven for abusing little kids (your brother/sister perhaps? Sons or daughters?) and get a place in heaven ahead of those that live a good life and just happen to believe in the wrong religion or not be religious at all?