Reading between the lines, it sadly sounds as if Howard2k belives that the United States is getting what it deserves when it comes to terrorist attacks.
I am sure there is a rush of people to prepare indictments and councilling for the people that commit terrorism.
No, that's not what I meant. Not at all. Although I don't think that the US is blameless, that's FAR FAR FAR different from suggesting that the US gets what it deserves.
It's just saddening that so many innocent people get caught in the middle of all of this, and for what?
Rightly or wrongly we right now have a disastrous situation in the Middle East and no end in sight.
I'm not suggesting that it's all one country that is promoting, influencing and provoking terrorism.
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The sad part is people who believe what is going on in the middle east has anything to do with any country. Or that the problems started with the invasion of Iraq. Or even that if the west would leave the area then all hostilities would stop.
These transmit only dialoges don't help either. Anybody going to read a post on the axim adicts web site and change their world view. I doubt it. My grandmother use to have a saying. "Opinions are like a##holes, everybody has one..... and yours stinks!
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How can it NOT have anything to do with any country?
I have a hunch that the US, UK and rest of the coalition, along with some of the Middle East countries such as Iraq, Iran, Afghanistan etc. all have SOMETHING to do with it :)
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Okay, then why are most "terrorist" not from those countries. Where do the terrorist come from Terrorbaniea? Terrorist is a name given to them by our controllers (gov and media) not the one chosen by them. They identify themselves as Muslims. Muslims are bound by religon first, family second and country last.
I'll give you this. If you really beleive that nothing is worth giving your life for, then the solution to the middle east is easy. We just all convert to Islam.
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Okay, then why are most "terrorist" not from those countries. Where do the terrorist come from Terrorbaniea? Terrorist is a name given to them by our controllers (gov and media) not the one chosen by them. They identify themselves as Muslims. Muslims are bound by religon first, family second and country last.
I'll give you this. If you really beleive that nothing is worth giving your life for, then the solution to the middle east is easy. We just all convert to Islam.
Those are the countries that are the most actively involved in the hot conflict right now, it's not an all inclusive list of all the states that participate in terrorism.
And not all terrorists are Muslim. Maybe (hopefully) I'm just misinterpreting that comment.
I don't think religion is worth me dying for. Whether it's Islam, Christianty or whatever. Just because I don't want to die for any particular religion does not mean that I should convert to Islam. Perhaps if those that are a little too unwilling to accept the religious choices of those that don't match their own would change their ways the world would be a better place.
And just to be clear - I'm not laying the blame of all of this on religion either.
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How can it NOT have anything to do with any country?
I have a hunch that the US, UK and rest of the coalition, along with some of the Middle East countries such as Iraq, Iran, Afghanistan etc. all have SOMETHING to do with it :)
Like Radimus said don't forget the French Howard2K. I will stay out of this as this is just provocation. Radimus, get a life.
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TORONTO (AP) - Police said Monday more arrests are likely in an alleged plot to bomb buildings in Canada, while intelligence officers sought ties between the 17 suspects and Islamic terror cells in the United States and five other nations.
A court said authorities had charged all 12 adults arrested over the weekend with participating in a terrorist group. Other charges included importing weapons and planning a bombing. The charges against five minors were not made public.
The Parliament of Canada, in Ottawa, is believed to be among targets the group discussed. Toronto Mayor David Miller said CN Tower, a downtown landmark, and the city's subway were not targets as had been the speculated in local media, but declined to identify sites that were.
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A U.S. law enforcement official said investigators were looking for connections between those detained in Canada and suspected Islamic militants held in the United States, Britain, Bangladesh, Bosnia, Denmark and Sweden.
American authorities have established that two men from Georgia who were charged this year in a terrorism case had been in contact with some of the Canadian suspects via computer, the official said, speaking on condition of anonymity because the investigation is continuing.
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Each is charged with one count of participating in a terrorist group.
Three of them - Fahim Ahmad, 21, Mohammed Dirie, 22, and Yasim Abdi Mohamed, 24 - also are charged with importing weapons and ammunition for the purpose of terrorist activity.
Nine face charges of receiving training from a terrorist group, while four are charged with providing training. Six also are charged with intending to cause an explosion that could cause serious bodily harm or death.
No information was released on the five young males arrested due to federal privacy laws that protect minors.
Canadian media have reported that the suspects attended a training camp in Washago, a rural community 90 north of Toronto. The National Post quoted unidentified residents in the wooded area as saying they heard machine-gun fire and saw men dressed in camouflage carrying equipment.
The Royal Canadian Mounted Police displayed evidence Saturday that included camouflage uniforms, flashlights, walkie-talkies and detonators, but have refused to confirm whether they were used at a training facility.
...
This is not inflammatory, it is news, it is current events, this stuff will affect all our lives and probably our kids lives. This is probably part of the biggest story in the world. This will outlast any group of politicians and is world-wide.
There is a big picture going on, sometimes you have to look up and see it.
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No offence, but did you look up to see the other terrorism events that pre-date 9/11?
Terrorism is not new and I've yet to see an example of terrorist organizations (and grass-roots terrorism) being beaten by an invading organized military organization. And I don't claim to be an expert. Maybe I'm wrong, it's just my point of view.
As benots4 said, they don't choose the name terrorist themselves. Not sure I 100% agree with that, but they would certainly mostly consider themselves "Freedom Fighters" as opposed to "Killers of innocent civilians". Anyway - I don't have all the answers either.
Where's Hejo so he can start calling me a Bush lover or an American lover!! :)
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Terrorists is what the big army calls the little army
Freedom fighters is what the little army calls themselves
collateral damage is what both call civilians
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And even that ended with the justice system, evidence, trial and conviction, rather than just holding people indefinately without trial.
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And even that ended with the justice system, evidence, trial and conviction, rather than just holding people indefinately without trial.
technically, it hasn't been indefinately, as they haven't been there forever.
That they haven't had a trial (or tribunal) yet, doesn't preclude that they will not get one in the future.
I could see an issue if the fighting was over or at least that the government has 'control' of the country and the place was under relative calm and they were still held.
So the issue is, are they being tried/released fast enough for some people opinions...
Sami Al-Arian was held in prison for about 3 years before his trial, his brother held for much longer... and these weren't picked up holding weapons in a combat zone.
All this has been discussed before, and yet it keeps coming back
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technically, it hasn't been indefinately, as they haven't been there forever.
That they haven't had a trial (or tribunal) yet, doesn't preclude that they will not get one in the future.
I could see an issue if the fighting was over or at least that the government has 'control' of the country and the place was under relative calm and they were still held.
So the issue is, are they being tried/released fast enough for some people opinions...
Sami Al-Arian was held in prison for about 3 years before his trial, his brother held for much longer... and these weren't picked up holding weapons in a combat zone.
All this has been discussed before, and yet it keeps coming back
No offence intended, but a while ago I uploaded a commentary on the legal status of Guantananmo Bay, which was studiously ignored by all and sundry.
If you are serious about the issue, then perhaps it would be good to go further than Google, and move beyond the level of banality that is curently being displayed.
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technically, it hasn't been indefinately, as they haven't been there forever.
in·def·i·nite (n-df-nt) adj. Not definite, especially:
Unclear; vague.
Lacking precise limits: an indefinite leave of absence.
Uncertain; undecided: indefinite about their plans.
indefinitely
adv : to an indefinite extent; for an indefinite time; "this could go on indefinitely"
So technically they are there indefinately!
Originally Posted by radimus
That they haven't had a trial (or tribunal) yet, doesn't preclude that they will not get one in the future.
I assume you are talking about camp X ray... and the US holding prisoners there. As opposed to say the actions of the British government and their use of internment against the IRA. The IRA always maintained that interment was the best recruiting tool they ever had..... and I suspect there may be a similar effect now.
Originally Posted by radimus
All this has been discussed before, and yet it keeps coming back
I thought that was the point of your thread... That it isn't going to go away. And as you pointed out the current stragery has never worked anywhere before... and even in the closest example you gave there was a major difference.
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Maybe I was wrong before about this disscussion changing anybody's mind. The problem is I think I changed my own mind. Or maybe a slight correction to what I originally thought on 912 with a twist. At that time I was wondering if 911 would be handled as a crime or act of war......
During the last election I knew several people who were voting for Bush entierly based on the Abortion issue. They were anti abortion. I tried to see the connection because to me the election was completely Abortion issue free. Yesterday I saw on the news that a Marrage adminment was being debated although nobody thought it would pass...... All for mid term elections???????
"Any terrorist attack on Canada is bound to be homegrown, because there is no shadowy but powerful network of international terrorists waging a war against the West. There are isolated small groups of extremists who blow things up once in a while, and there are websites and other media through which they can exchange ideas and techniques, but there is no headquarters, no chain of command, no organization that can be defeated, dismantled and destroyed
"
If this is all true then W is no moron. (not that I ever believed he was)
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