How to drop asleep if you're not tired?

JustJ · 06-11-06, 05:54 PM

Dear fellas,
again I'm writin a question that hopefully not only interest's me.
I'm having the problem that I should Learn for my final exams, so it means:
Get up early - Go to bed early.
Usually I get up 1 PM and get to bed 6 AM
And this is not the best to learn.
The problem is: no matter how early I go to bed, I can't sleep till 2:00 or 3:00.
So I'm asking the big oracle of Aximsite:
What can I do to go to sleep without beeing tired.
(maybe with one limitation: I should be able to learn the next das, so no sledgehammer please)

aximbigfan · 06-11-06, 05:57 PM

this is how i do i do it...

i am usally up on my notebook until pretty late at night.. uassaly to the point to where i am so tired that i just sort of unconchusly put my notebook back up on my desk and fall asleep...'

chris

JustJ · 06-11-06, 05:58 PM

Yup this is how I do it also usually, but that point is about 6 AM, that means up at 2:00 PM and not capable of learning...

aximbigfan · 06-11-06, 06:01 PM

Originally Posted by JustJ

Yup this is how I do it also usually, but that point is about 6 AM, that means up at 2:00 PM and not capable of learning...

well, you said no slege hammer, but ya never said nothing bout a regular hammer!

chris

JustJ · 06-11-06, 06:03 PM

... no comment ... :)

Jukov · 06-11-06, 06:17 PM

You're right - this is the worst way to study.
When I get too many sleepless nights on my account and I start feeling affected by it I would skip one morning sleep and continue thru the day , then go to bed at a normal hour and force myself to get up early the next morning. It's a good idea not to study until the late hours but have a two hour break before going to bed. Try not to eat, during that time and have a nice half hour walk. Do not exercise, just walk. Do not watch TV. Listen to a quiet music or read a book (if your brain can take it lol).

06-11-06, 06:29 PM

I listen to talk radio,works every time.

netsyd · 06-11-06, 06:58 PM

I got married. That solved all my late night problems. Funny how getting married makes you feel old...

Seriously ... Jukov's got the right idea. When you find yourself with a really funky schedule and it isn't working for you anymore, do a 24 hour plus day and then go to bed at the time you would like to go to sleep.

Pocketbrain · 06-11-06, 07:45 PM

I hear viewing "An inconvenient truth" works wonders.

(X)
.

Tankman · 06-11-06, 08:21 PM

Early to bed, early to rise! That's me!

Early to bed sometimes takes a number of Manhattans!

Nighty night!

**Frenchy** · 06-11-06, 08:35 PM

When I am no tired I can't sleep either so I just stay up until I drop and even then I try to stay up so I go to bed exhausted. The next day after having only 1 to 3 hours to sleep I can sleep early enought to retime my daily internal schedule. When I post late at night until the morning hours. I am having one of these night. I'll be looking for you then.

benots4 · 06-11-06, 08:49 PM

It is not when you goto Bed, but when You wake up That matters. Start getting up at 5:oo Am and you will go to Sleep at 10. Sometimes I can only make it to 9.

**Frenchy** · 06-11-06, 09:04 PM

Originally Posted by benots4

It is not when you goto Bed, but when You wake up That matters. Start getting up at 5:oo Am and you will go to Sleep at 10. Sometimes I can only make it to 9.

I get up at 5:00 Mon to Fri and I go to bed in the neighborhood of 11:00 most night. It is different for everyone. Some people needs less sleep than others. Sure the time you get up mades a difference on your night but I am sure that at times you can stay up longer no problems.

06-11-06, 09:06 PM

Originally Posted by benots4

It is not when you goto Bed, but when You wake up That matters. Start getting up at 5:oo Am and you will go to Sleep at 10. Sometimes I can only make it to 9.

Actually, it is both. Maintaining a regular waking time and bedtime are considered to be important components of sleep hygiene (along with cutting down on caffeine, not using alcohol to fall asleep, overusing sleep preparations, etc.)

rroberts161 · 06-11-06, 09:28 PM

Have you tried melatonin? This is a chemical that the human brain makes, and seems to be related to sleep cycles. It does not leave any hangover, but has been demonstrated to help glob trotters recover from jet-lag.

Eschew benzodiazapines (such as Valium, Ativan, Xanax etc.) as these drugs might make you sleep, but have been associated with serious memory impairment. Avoid barbiturates (eg. Seconol, Nembutal) as these tend to work only for a couple weeks without requiring dose escalation. And of course, barbiturates are physically addictive, so dose escalation is a serious risk. Also, the margin of safety for fast acting barbiturates is somewhat narrow, so escalated doses can augment overdose threat.

Chloral Hydrate is a non-barbiturate/non-benzodiazapines hypnotic. This drug is not recommended for ongoing use, and has an action that lasts only a couple hours. Chronic early-waking insomnia (where the patient falls asleep easily, but wakes later and cannot resume restful sleep) is refractive to treatment with chloral hydrate because although it promotes sleep, it wears off fast.

Barbiturates, benzodiazapines and chloral hydrate all disrupt normal sleep patterns. The real value of them as agents to help recover from sleep deficits is compromised by this fact. Restful sleep is a cyclic process, and disruption of the cycles impairs the usefulness of sleep.

There are three newer sedative/hypnotics on the market in the US, zolpidem (Ambien), eszopiclone (Lunesta) and zaleplon (Sonata). All three of these drugs induce sleep, and except for Sonata, they are approved for long term use. These drugs do not seem to cause tolerance in any typical matter, and both Ambien and Lunesta are said to remain effective for as long as six months.

The primary drawbacks regarding Lunesta, Ambien and Sonata are cost and the potential for residual sedative effects upon waking(hangover). Ambien alone has been linked to profound amnesia for the period of sedation when taken in conjunction with alcohol.

Personally, I would try melatonin first so see if I responded to it. If this failed, I would see a physician and ask about Ambien or Lunesta. I suggest taking any sedative hypnotic drug the first time or two on a night where a free day followed. It is very difficult to predict an given individual's response to these chemicals, and it is better if the patient not have to work or attend school the day following the initial doses.

Good luck! Keep in mind that most doctors do not like to prescribe sedative-hypnotics, and regardless of what drugs they might order, they will want you to use them only briefly. The real answer to sleep problems like you describe is to work out a schedule that affords you consistent sleep times. Drugs can certainly help you to adapt to a new schedule or time zone, and melatonin is often effective in helping with this.