patrickj

Agree with all that. But also think England need more creative players in the side and a formation that works for them. Think 3-5-2 can work for sides like the Dutch or some of the South American sides - no way it works for England with their current (or any recent) squad ...

AlbaJoe

totally agree PatrickJ. I think 4-4-2 all the way.

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psionandy

We should have gone for Martin O'neill.
he even said he'd have taken the job.

But we went for the second part of the management team that was so successful at the world cup and nothing has changed

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patrickj

Agree - think O'Neill is a very good manager, even got Celtic going. I wish Bobby Robson was a few years younger - would take him back too ...

AlbaJoe

martin Oneil for sure. He would create a rock solid spine to the team with first principle of we shall not lose. The current England setup think they must win because they 'think' they have world class players. I think they have some really good players but only see Gerrard as world class, IMHO. So it comes down to the manager for me. Oneil would build his team round Gerrard, and slowly you might see the quality come out of the rest of the team.

The difference between Scotland and England results is that we go in saying we are not going to lose this without a fight. England on the other hand start thinking about how many goals they are going to win by. Its a state of mind.

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patrickj

Gerrard is definitely world class and England's best player. I think John Terry is pretty close to world class too. Also, Rooney is capable of being - although obviously needs to learn to stop being such a nutter if he's ever going to live up to his natural talents.

One thing I would differ on in terms of what's lacking in English attitude and approach to matches is that I've seen a lot of matches over the years where it was not over-confidence that killed them, but rather an intensely frustrating 'Play Not To Lose' approach - often when they've gone up by a goal against someone. The overconfidence might be there against 'lesser' opponents, but the frustrating try not to lsoe sysndrome seems to rear its ugly head whenever they're facing a Brazil or Germany type opponent.

Also, in terms of core problems for them, when's the last time they had anybody in a central midfield role who could create his way out of a (very thin) paper bag?

Originally Posted by AlbaJoe

martin Oneil for sure. He would create a rock solid spine to the team with first principle of we shall not lose. The current England setup think they must win because they 'think' they have world class players. I think they have some really good players but only see Gerrard as world class, IMHO. So it comes down to the manager for me. Oneil would build his team round Gerrard, and slowly you might see the quality come out of the rest of the team. The difference between Scotland and England results is that we go in saying we are not going to lose this without a fight. England on the other hand start thinking about how many goals they are going to win by. Its a state of mind.

aximbigfan

wqhy does soccer even matter? its just a bunch of people running around kickign a ball to to no end...
*waits to get flamed*

chris

patrickj

That could be said / asked of just about any sport - baseball, football of the helmet / pads / hard hitting variety and even the mighty synhcronized swimming - none of 'em are gonna provide world peace or double the available RAM in our Axims - so they're all pointless if you don't enjoy them ...

Originally Posted by aximbigfan

wqhy does soccer even matter? its just a bunch of people running around kickign a ball to to no end... *waits to get flamed* chris

psionandy

Originally Posted by patrickj

Gerrard is definitely world class and England's best player. I think John Terry is pretty close to world class too. Also, Rooney is capable of being - although obviously needs to learn to stop being such a nutter if he's ever going to live up to his natural talents. One thing I would differ on in terms of what's lacking in English attitude and approach to matches is that I've seen a lot of matches over the years where it was not over-confidence that killed them, but rather an intensely frustrating 'Play Not To Lose' approach - often when they've gone up by a goal against someone. The overconfidence might be there against 'lesser' opponents, but the frustrating try not to lsoe sysndrome seems to rear its ugly head whenever they're facing a Brazil or Germany type opponent. Also, in terms of core problems for them, when's the last time they had anybody in a central midfield role who could create his way out of a (very thin) paper bag?

Get out of my head..... that's what I was thinking..

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AlbaJoe

chris, andy might correct me on this but I believe it was the late great Bill Shankly who said 'they say football isn't life and death. I agree....its more important than that'.

Or words to that affect.

In Europe many of our teams histories go back well more than a century.

Why has it lasted ? well its a grounding for common identity, cameradary, competition and the smell of a cold saturday afternoon. It allows peaceful nations, cities, towns etc. to go to war for 90 minutes without losing a single life (with the exception of the The Old Firm patrickJ :~)

We are born to it and love it it is a way of life. The Tartan Army travels the world to watch their team lose there is much more to it than kicking a ball.

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AlbaJoe

Originally Posted by psionandy

Get out of my head..... that's what I was thinking..

don't get me wrong, I may be way off but I base my opinion on what my English mates and the English football pundits say. Phil Neville (the everton one) did an excellent interview where he pretty much said that their over confidence has cost them in the past and is something that has to change.

Try listening to Scottish fans and our media. We are very logical and realistic. You will very rarely hear us going into a game expecting to win. Pessimistic I know but its the way we are, we dream ....... sometimes they come true.

I suppose the 'lets not lose' mind set is global unless your France...... then they get pumped by the Jocks lol.

What we need is the Home nations games back. I think all the British teams would benefit and get us back into dominance.

patrickj

Well said - very. Love that Shankly quote and had forgotten it. And the Tartan Army are superb, great fun, and do themselves proud at just about every major tournament (that they make it to - cough) ...

Originally Posted by AlbaJoe

chris, andy might correct me on this but I believe it was the late great Bill Shankly who said 'they say football isn't life and death. I agree....its more important than that'. Or words to that affect. In Europe many of our teams histories go back well more than a century. Why has it lasted ? well its a grounding for common identity, cameradary, competition and the smell of a cold saturday afternoon. It allows peaceful nations, cities, towns etc. to go to war for 90 minutes without losing a single life (with the exception of the The Old Firm patrickJ :~) We are born to it and love it it is a way of life. The Tartan Army travels the world to watch their team lose there is much more to it than kicking a ball.

patrickj

Hmmm - Phil Neville has been in and around the squad a whole lot (too much).

I think the Dutch are masters of overconfidence too.

Home Nations matches = wow, that would be good, but scary when England- Scotland get together. I was in Glasgow for the 2nd leg of the European Championship qualifying tie (when England and Scotland both didn't get through the group stage cleanly) - that was a scary and fun night - if I remember right the only verse in the favored song at 2:00am that night walking home from the pub / club was "With a packet of sweets and a cheeky smile, Shearer is a f***ing pedophile" ...

Originally Posted by AlbaJoe

don't get me wrong, I may be way off but I base my opinion on what my English mates and the English football pundits say. Phil Neville (the everton one) did an excellent interview where he pretty much said that their over confidence has cost them in the past and is something that has to change. Try listening to Scottish fans and our media. We are very logical and realistic. You will very rarely hear us going into a game expecting to win. Pessimistic I know but its the way we are, we dream ....... sometimes they come true. I suppose the 'lets not lose' mind set is global unless your France...... then they get pumped by the Jocks lol. What we need is the Home nations games back. I think all the British teams would benefit and get us back into dominance.

e_tellurian

Competitive sport is a great way to learn sportsmanship.

This sport offers all countries an opportunity to field a team. All that is needed is one really passionate player (a coach) to ask around their nation for interested donors and off they go. This is a sport for ladies and gentlemen.

Some of the teams here have been at the game along time. i am sure there passion for the sport is an inspiration for nations to field more teams.

Now this sport is an Olympic event too.

E-T

AlbaJoe

lol I am amazed just how much you picked up when you were here. You really sound like you embraced the country, culture and people.

The tension between England & Scotland in these games is electric. They did well to steal a win at Hampden then lol. When we played them in the return at Wembley it was supposed to be the last game at their stadium. They thought it would be nice to cap of the history there with a final humping of the 'jocks'... lol not on your nelly lol. I am sure that is what drove us on to beat them and it was very very close for who went through. The matches we have against each other are fantastic and as long as fans don't do anything silly (points at the English he he) then I don't think there is a single international match in the world that can come near it. Its always a David and Goliath epic and both sides just love it.
Its very sad that the home nations was dropped but that was in the days of some very unsavoury characters stirring up trouble on both sides. I don't think it is any where near as bad now. Mind you a m8 that came back from the Ukraine with the Tartan Army said that the locals were very very unfriendly with all sorts of preorganised attacks on our fans. LOL they were taught a lesson by the Tartan Army mind you. They may win the good will prizes etc. but wake the sleeping lion you are bound to get bit.

So did you follow the british clubs in Europe this week ? some nice results. Especially my not so favourite club, celtic.

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Moe (Simpsons) on judgement day:

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