Zardoz, I am not exactly clear how "Hijacking a BT connection" is even remotely close to a gray area. There is nothing gray about it. At best, you are talking about spam...at worst...theft of services or worse. Nothing gray to me there.
Doug
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I would like the people who say this is illegal or an invasion of privacy to back up that claim.
Am I invading your privacy by talking to you when you don't care to hear me? Am I invading your privacy by sending you an unsolicited email or letter? What of your privacy have I invaded? Does publisher's clearing house make you feel threatened? Honestly, the privacy claim is quite weak. The strongest version I see is if you want to argue that access to your cell phone or bluetooth device is private -- however if you have a BT device in discoverable mode with no passcode, that means you don't care if people care to connect to your device. Your BT device is actively responding to requests and advertising its presence and willingness to connect -- it is hardly being private.
As to the illegality of it, I seriously doubt the law has caught up with complicated issues like bluetooth. However, afaik, even illegal SPAM is much more narrow, and not just any unsolicited email. Since it is most likely legal, if you wanted to make it illegal - what would you make illegal, with what punishment, and why? For example, if any unsolicited email is illegal, what if I typed the wrong email address? Or what if I'm protesting a company's action, and decide to email their CEO? Why should the ability to send a message through bluetooth be any different? Is it any different from handing out flyers, or walking down the street with you and making you listen to me talk? If so, what's different and how should that be dealt with?
Anyhow, my suggestion is that we take care before we revert to a visceral argument like "my privacy" or "my right to blah". As the people who use this technology most and understand its implications better, we need take heed when people claim something is illegal or that it should be -- or one day we'll discover we have another DMCA on our hands and can't play videos on whatever device we want.
akao & ultramagneous, just a question out of curiosity....
If I can force a BT connection to send a chat message, whats to keep me from forcing my way into other information that's stored on the target PDA??
Without knowing anything at all about BTsnarfing or BlueJacking this is the first think that comes to mind regarding the legality of it all....
Akao, illegality is not the main point being commented on, we are mainly discussing SPAM. But now that we know your feelings about unwanted advertising etc I now know what email address to forward the 100 or so junk emails I get every day.
I maintain that spamming to a portable device is an invasion of my privacy because in addition to all the annoyances associated with "junk mail" you would also be using MY resources like battery and memory space.
Similarly, it would be worse if I receive unwanted calls to my cell phone (i.e. telemarketing) because then you are possibly costing me minutes and additional expense.
Zardoz, I am not exactly clear how "Hijacking a BT connection" is even remotely close to a gray area. There is nothing gray about it. At best, you are talking about spam...at worst...theft of services or worse. Nothing gray to me there.
Doug
Spam, let's see, in some states you can get fined and/or go to jail for it. granted this is more about email/phone but same different s, also the act of bypassing the BT passcodes to do it can raise eyebrow's I am sure...
Theft of service or worse? THEFT!!!! last time I checked any theft of service was wrong. and I am sure you can go to jail for that, and as for worse, lets say you get in and delete some files, well again jail for you buddy.
So when I say gray area, I mean you are in high risk of doing something that can get you in to trouble, no if's and's or butts about it...
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Zardoz, sorry if I was unclear. You put me on the wrong side of your gray area there. I was saying that it is quite clearly wrong, and at best it was spam, at worst a criminal act depending upon how you define hijacking.
Either way, I think we are now both making the same point. :)
Doug
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someone mentioned people in the same room chatting on a phone via text. Believe it or not, this apparently is a huge social norm in some places lately. At Mobius, we had a long session about these social behaviors with their phones. Susi from shiny shiny ( I think she's in the UK ) said that people are doing this in bars. We discussed some really out there concepts to embrace these social things that are starting to be centered around young folks phones.
I am not condoning this guys actions, just talking about how the social world is weird now.
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I suppose I can understand that in a crowded bar where it is difficult to talk...then again, I would liketo see some of those messages after a few too many if you know what I mean. :)
Doug
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Zardoz, sorry if I was unclear. You put me on the wrong side of your gray area there. I was saying that it is quite clearly wrong, and at best it was spam, at worst a criminal act depending upon how you define hijacking.
Either way, I think we are now both making the same point. :)
Doug
lol, no worries... and we are now :P
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Box, don't misunderstand my arguments that bluejacking should not be illegal and that it doesn't violate a right as meaning that it is ethically right. The law and our rights are not, and should not be, the only guide posts for morality. Kids teasing other kids is not illegal, but does that mean you should teach your kids to tease other kids? In fact, legality and rights are at times directly contradictory to morality. Writing unfounded accusations about a person is a legally protected right, but does that mean people should do it? If you think forwarding me SPAM is ethical, then I can only hope most people do not agree with you.
BTCrawler is great, works alot like WiFiFoFum but for bluetooth. BTCrawler is a nice tool to have if your in to wireless stuff.
As for his request, I think he is looking to hijack a BT connection, this is a gray area for sure.
i have had problems with BTCrawler, it seems to hang, dunno if it just hasnt worked on the person i am trying to bluejack or not
no, i am not trying to hijack a bluetooth connection... just send them a message.
Originally Posted by rogue9
akao & ultramagneous, just a question out of curiosity....
If I can force a BT connection to send a chat message, whats to keep me from forcing my way into other information that's stored on the target PDA??
Without knowing anything at all about BTsnarfing or BlueJacking this is the first think that comes to mind regarding the legality of it all....
forcing your way into others information is called bluesnarfing, and it only effects a few phones with a perticular vulnerability, of course that is completely illigal.
as for spamming, most phones will actually ask if you want to accept a message AFAIK, just as if you were sending somone a file or diary entry via IR or BT. mainly because BT was originally designed to be used just like IRDA
just to clear things up, i am not spamming, it can just get really noisy at my school in the common room, to the point that you would have to stand up and yell at the top of your voice to get somones attention normally (looking like an idiot). this is much easier (if, i can get it to work)
If you think forwarding me SPAM is ethical, then I can only hope most people do not agree with you.
Don't worry, I'm not going send you my spam, I was just trying to make the point about ethical, legal and annoying. I get enough crap in my letterbox, inbox, websites, telephone etc... that I have to spend time and energy to get rid of that I don't wont any more.
I have 2 mobile phones, 1 German and 1 Finnish, both with BT on but set to invisible and a least once a day I get some twat somehow trying to send me a message via BT. I have to take the phone out, unlock the keypad, say No, lock the keypad and put the phone away. Not hard, but bloody annoying. Add to that the various useless text messages you get from the service provider about your account and the ones every time you enter a new country.... I could go on and on but, I'll leave it at that.
Actually you did ask about bluesnarfing, even if you did say "maybe", and you know that to be illegal.
There is only three reasons to bluejack
1. Dumb Prank - scaring the oldsters who thing somnething is wrong or someone is trying to hack their phones.
2. Send risque or outright nasty comments to women - otherwise why would you like to be anonymous. I've seen this on trains, its a form of sexual harrassment or at best a dim hope she will respond positively.
3. Sending ads like spam to phones with out permission.
It is illegal to spam people and it's unethical to bluejack them. If you abuse this it will become illegal eventually.
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