as77

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Originally posted by pcdoctorca And you get those drivers where??? Can you identify specific components, their hardware version, specific changes made by the PPC manufacturer?

Of course I can. The X5 uses the MediaQ 1132 chip practically for everything. It's a standard component that is part of several other Pocket PCs. There are no "specific changes made by the PPC manufacturer". You don't think Dell is going to request a modified chip, do you? The source code of drivers for this chip were available from MediaQ (now part of NVIDIA) for free. Even Microsoft itself included several drivers for MediaQ chips in its platform builder for Windows CE. Dell didn't have to develop any new drivers from scratch.

cageyjames

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Originally posted by as77 I think exactly the same thing about you.

You can think it, but I have a track record. I have worked on Windows CE implementations, you continue to prove you cannot grasp the concept of what is required here.

Face it, you are barking up the wrong tree here.

1. You'll never get a copy of Windows Mobile 2003 to start with.
2. You'll never get all the drivers required to complete such a task.

as77

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Originally posted by cageyjames You can think it, but I have a track record. I have worked on Windows CE implementations.

I strongly doubt that you actually have. Probably you are not telling the whole truth here again. You did this in other threads, so I'm not surpised.

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1. You'll never get a copy of Windows Mobile 2003 to start with. 2. You'll never get all the drivers required to complete such a task.

Where on earth did you get the idea that I want to do this?

cestode

are some forum rules being broken in this thread?

cageyjames

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Originally posted by as77 Probably you are not telling the whole truth here again. You did this in other threads, so I'm not surpised.

Oh, so you have no idea what you are talking about and must flame me?

Show me where I have ever said anything that wasn't true. People who have followed me for the 1.5 years here know I develop Pocket PC applications for the Military and have worked on custom devices.

As with most people who are proven wrong, you feel you must attack me personally in an attempt to make yourself seem bigger than I am. Frankly your attempt only proves my point you don't know what you are talking about.

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Where on earth did you get the idea that I want to do this?

You said any idiot could do it in half a day. I was responding that you coudn't even get the required parts to even have a chance to do it.

cageyjames

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Originally posted by cestode are some forum rules being broken in this thread?

At this point, no. But if someone were to explain how the did do it, the thread would probably be removed.

as77

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Originally posted by cageyjames Show me where I have ever said anything that wasn't true.

I already showed that you distorted the truth and used dishonest debating techniques in the "Will Dell release WM2003SE for the X5?" thread. You haven't even replied.

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People who have followed me for the 1.5 years here know I develop Pocket PC applications for the Military and have worked on custom devices.

We are talking about compiling the OS here, not about applications. Compiling the OS is a routine task. An instructional video can be downloaded from MS that shows the process. It's about 30 or 40 minutes long and the complete OS is compiled during that time, with a lot of idle time in between when the guy just explains what he's doing. Microsoft has made the process as easy as it can get. You don't even have to use the keyboard, you get a nice GUI and compiling the OS is little more than clicking around with the mouse for some time.

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As with most people who are proven wrong,

So far you have just denied what I said but you have not proven me wrong.

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You said any idiot could do it in half a day.

I said "average programmer" and I meant those guys who are working for Toshiba or Dell or another PPC manufacturer, not just anyone who doesn't even have access to the platform builder. What I meant was that they had everything ready. Platform builder and several drivers from MS, other drivers from the component manufacturers. They didn't have to spend a minute developing a new driver from scratch. There is nothing so special about the Axim that requires writing a completely new driver. There is no "Axim chip" in it. The Axim is built out of standard components, the drivers of which come from the component manufacturers and are readily available for the PPC manufacturers. The guys working for the PPC manufacturers don't have to develop drivers for these components themselves, at most they set some configuration options but that's about all. That is why I think that there is no fundamental reason why an OS image for one device could not work on another device that is essentially built out of the same or highly compatible components. Just think about it, the MQ1132 chip is being used in several different PPCs, e.g. Axim X5, Toshiba e330, etc. Don't you think it would be stupid if the programmers at Dell and Toshiba had to develop the same driver for this chip independently? They didn't do that and it was not necessary because MediaQ provided them with the driver.

cageyjames

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Originally posted by as77 I already showed that you distorted the truth and used dishonest debating techniques in the "Will Dell release WM2003SE for the X5?" thread. You haven't even replied.

What thread is that? I don't recall lying in it.

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We are talking about compiling the OS here, not about applications. Compiling the OS is a routine task. An instructional video can be downloaded from MS that shows the process. It's about 30 or 40 minutes long and the complete OS is compiled during that time, with a lot of idle time in between when the guy just explains what he's doing. Microsoft has made the process as easy as it can get. You don't even have to use the keyboard, you get a nice GUI and compiling the OS is little more than clicking around with the mouse for some time.

Sure compiling the OS is an easy task. But getting WindowsCE ready for the compile is not. I have designed (not the hardware) custom devices using WindowsCE for the Navy and I know what a pain in the ass it is to get the OS ready. We even had Microsoft helping us on the project and they had trouble.

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So far you have just denied what I said but you have not proven me wrong.

Huh? What are you talking about? Face these facts little man.

1. Chris thought enough of me to make me an Administrator here at Aximsite
2. Pocket PC Magazine thinks enough of me to Judge software for them.
3. Jason Dunn thinks enough of me to make me an editor over at ThoughtsMedia.

I've earn the trust of these people and there is nothing you can do to prove that I have lied or been dishonest in any way.

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<snip>

Yawn, you are proving my point.

as77

I'm not interested in your credentials and I don't appreciate your citing your credentials instead of presenting actual arguments. And since you were dishonest once, from this point I have no reason to believe you anything anyway.

Until you can name the component in the Axim X5 that Dell had to develop its own driver from scratch for, I consider my case as being proven and yours refuted.

cageyjames

Again, where have I been dishonest? You keep attacking my character for no reason.

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Until you can name the component in the Axim X5 that Dell had to develop its own driver from scratch for, I consider my case as being proven and yours refuted.

Proves what? That I don't know 100% of all components of the X5?

as77

When you quoted a sentence from the Dell forums' Terms of Service document, you deliberately omitted half of the sentence, thereby changing its meaning to the opposite. And you knew that. That's what I think was dishonest.

Your point seems to be that Dell's programmers have developed specific, unique drivers from scratch for some of the Axim's components. But you cannot bring up a concrete example, you are just claiming this in general and you are trying to appeal to your own authority to support your point. I, on the other hand, brought up the example of the MediaQ 1132 chip, which does virtually everything in the Axim that needs a driver, and I pointed out the fact that MediaQ provided drivers for it. Therefore, my point is strongly supported, while yours is not.

cageyjames

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Originally posted by as77 When you quoted a sentence from the Dell forums' Terms of Service document, you deliberately omitted half of the sentence, thereby changing its meaning to the opposite. And you knew that. That's what I think was dishonest.

So you were dishonest for leaving out the part that says they aren't liable for anything that happens on the forums, no matter who says it.

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Dell does not warrant or guarantee the accuracy, reliability, completeness, usefulness, non-infringement of intellectual property rights, or quality of any content on the Community Forum, regardless of who originates that content.

I'm not sure what your point is. :crooked:

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Your point seems to be that Dell's programmers have developed specific, unique drivers from scratch for some of the Axim's components. But you cannot bring up a concrete example, you are just claiming this in general and you are trying to appeal to your own authority to support your point. I, on the other hand, brought up the example of the MediaQ 1132 chip, which does virtually everything in the Axim that needs a driver, and I pointed out the fact that MediaQ provided drivers for it. Therefore, my point is strongly supported, while yours is not.

I never said Dell wrote drivers from scratch. I doubt any PDA maker does. But they do work closely with those who make the chips. I'm just not sure where you are going with this. As I said before, you can't download all the drivers required for free on the internet.

as77

OK, then I don't see where you are disagreeing with me. Seems that you have finally realized that I'm right.

I still don't understand why you are mentioning that I can't download the drivers. I never said anything remotely suggestive of that. However, I'm positive that I could request the drivers from MediaQ (now Nvidia) and they would provide them for free after signing some license agreement. But I'm not into such a project.

pcdoctorca

And I can't remember how often I've put cheap NICs in systems, to have WIndows recognize the off the shelf chipset, but the NIC won't work without the NIC manufacturer's drivers. Just because a device uses a standard component does not mean it doe not require a customized driver. Now, Dell may not have written the driver, but I doubt that it could be gotten anywhere.

__________________
Dell Axim X5 400 A05. WM2003. iGPS-CF. Mapopolis 4.42

cageyjames

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Originally posted by as77 OK, then I don't see where you are disagreeing with me. Seems that you have finally realized that I'm right.

Huh? I still don't agree with your statement that you could get this done in half a day. I'm not sure where else I have ever disagreed with you.

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I still don't understand why you are mentioning that I can't download the drivers. I never said anything remotely suggestive of that. However, I'm positive that I could request the drivers from MediaQ (now Nvidia) and they would provide them for free after signing some license agreement. But I'm not into such a project.

As I said, how could you possible complile a working copy of WM 2003 without all the drives. Sure the MediaQ divers will help, but you still need the others to get a working device. I'm not sure how this makes creating an OS a quick exercise. :crooked: