PXA250 C1 Upgrade Soon?

Sarkoon · 03-12-03, 03:10 PM

You may recall the announcement of an updated PXA250 processor at the end of January, as mentioned in this thread (among others):

http://www.aximsite.com/boards/showt...ight=pxa250+c1

And although the March 31st deadline for Dell and other Manufacturers to begin releasing the C1 processor is rapidly approaching, I have yet to see any recent news about it.

Anyone have any info? Is the Axim going to be updated with the C1 processor soon?

TIA...

-Sarkoon

ARM Hacker · 03-12-03, 04:18 PM

The CPU won't be called the PXA 250, it will be the PXA255 or something else, and although it will be pin-compatible I doubt there will be any AximX5's shipped with it, probably just a newer PDA.

One thing to keep in mind is the sheer number of PXA250 B2 chips that have already been manufactured and are waiting to sell. I don't think anyone will pick up the new chips until they are done manufacturing from the current set of chips, which they can probably get at better deals now than a few months ago.

axmax · 03-12-03, 09:48 PM

The chip has been out for a few weeks now, and the Dell sales rep I spoke with a few days ago seemed to be downplaying it's significance. Maybe he just wanted to make a sale...but maybe Dell will just slip it in without much fanfare.

Is there a way for someone to check their newly received unit to see what chip they have?

WindWalker · 03-12-03, 10:05 PM

I doubt that Dell would slip in a change like that without letting people know, simply because it has been touted as so much faster and less power hungry. You don't slipstream a selling point like that without tooting your own horn a bit ;)

JakeRich · 03-12-03, 10:42 PM

The new chip is not a drop in replacement, so don't look for it anytime soon. The entire motherboard has to be reengineered, so maybe 4th qtr, maybe next year. The huge stockpile of original 250's will be used up first, before anyone gets serious about the 255's.

axmax · 03-12-03, 11:35 PM

Quote:

Originally posted by JakeRich
The new chip is not a drop in replacement, so don't look for it anytime soon. The entire motherboard has to be reengineered, so maybe 4th qtr, maybe next year. The huge stockpile of original 250's will be used up first, before anyone gets serious about the 255's.

Interesting points, but Dell is known for carrying almost no inventory, and product life cycles continue to get shorter. Not shure about the Axim, though, since it is built overseas.

:) :) :)

WindWalker · 03-12-03, 11:42 PM

Exactly. The low inventory model works for PCs since they build them. but since Wistron assembles them for Dell, the model doesn't exactly apply. We've certainly seen that in the delivery wait times, hmm? :crooked:

Sarkoon · 03-12-03, 11:45 PM

Intel Product Change Notification:
http://developer.intel.com/design/pc...s/D0102973.pdf

So in this document, what exactly does "Date Customer Must Be Ready to Receive Post-Conversion Material: Mar 28, 2003" mean? That Dell must be able to start using the new processor in it's assembly lines by that date? Or that we, customers of Dell, should be able to get our hands on a product using this new chip?

It's all quite confusing to me, but I placed an order for an Axim the other day just the same. Hopefully if they do suddenly come out with a new version, it'll be within their 30 day satisfaction guarantee.

-Sarkoon

Fritz · 03-13-03, 12:40 AM

It might be wrong for me to post it on an Axim site -- but if someone wants a PPC with the new chip, the new Toshiba e750/5 should be shipping soon.

Cheers.

Selective · 03-13-03, 06:08 AM

I got my axim today and its beutiful !!

And it looks like i got the C1 upgrade !

it says "PDA,400mhz,clem,eng,C1-2" Rev: A00
MFG Date: 030220

So i guess its out now. :D

io333 · 03-13-03, 09:45 AM

Where do you see that info?

ARM Hacker · 03-13-03, 11:07 AM

If you go to start->settings and then the System tab, then to 'About' You can see a line for "Processor".. Mine says "Intel(r) PXA250". The C0 and later stepping of the processor should be the PXA255, I think.

As for the motherboard upgrade, no, its pin compatible. Its really just the same chip with some fixes in the design to make the cache be usable (among many other things)

I thought there was a spot to see where it said 'B2' for the stepping. Its easy to write a program to check if its not anywhere in PocketPC already.

ARM Hacker · 03-13-03, 11:10 AM

OK, so I think perhaps going to Start-Settings the the System tab, then choosing 'System Information' Will get you the info.

If you do this, you don't see much on the screen. But then go into File Explorer and go to \My Documents\SysInfo and open up SysInfo.txt. That has a lot of information.

The second line says (for me)

CPU: Intel(r) PXA250 400Mhz B2

So Selective, try that and let us know.

JakeRich · 03-13-03, 11:22 AM

Quote:

Originally posted by ARM Hacker
As for the motherboard upgrade, no, its pin compatible. Its really just the same chip with some fixes in the design to make the cache be usable (among many other things)

What I meant was that although you can replace it on the motherboard, you don't get the benefits because all of the supporting hardware has to be capable of supporting the increased bus speed. That includes memory, display, and other devices. So, yes, you can drop it in, and no, that won't, most likely, get you the increase you might expect. Sorry about the confusion.

ARM Hacker · 03-13-03, 11:33 AM

I think we're talking about different things. The PXA255 (C0 Stepping as I believe it will be called) is no different than the PXA250. The PXA250 had a layout problem where a few cache lines were to close to some other logic in the core. This caused bits to flip under very rare and weird circumstances (relating to heat, and other things).

When these bits flipped, a cache line or two got corrupted and then written out to memory, causing data corruption. Since that's not really desirable the only option was to turn off ALL writeback caching in PocketPC 2002. The new stepping of the chip is no different, except that you COULD turn on writeback caching (improving speed quite a bit, maybe 20%) and not worry about your cache data being corrupted. As it is today, even if you had one of these you wouldn't see a difference, because PocketPC 2002 isn't set up for it. But an upgrade would be possible (whereas no upgrade would help you with a B2 chip).

There is another product mentioned that supports a faster bus speed, and if you recall from the 2002 fall Intel Developer Forum, Wireless MMX was announced as something going into future XScale products. Just like anything else there is a long roadmap with lots of exciting things that will start coming out in the future.