JmE

Thanks to posts by Planet-II and others, I checked my PXA255 Axim Advanced (running PocketPC 2002) and apparently the default state for the processor settings are for a 100 MHZ (99) internal bus (PXBus). It should be 200 MHZ (199) since it is a PXA255 and the information on the Intel site does not lead me to belive that hardware changes made by Dell are likely a cause.

It was first brought up in relation to CPUID v1.3 showing a PXBus speed of 200 (199) on the HP 2215 and 100 (99) on a PXA255 Axim Advanced. After disabling Pocket HackMaster, my Axim confirmed these findings. I also checked with Pocket HackMaster's fetch function and it appears that the Axim sets the system to L=27 M=2 N=2 which would result in an internal bus speed (PXBus) of 100 instead of what it should be, 200.

After using Pocket HackMaster to set the values to L=27 M=4 N=1, CPUID reports my Axim as running a PXBus of 200. Indeed, the results from CPUID for the 2215 and Axim are identical. This leads me to believe that it is not a hardware limitation of the Axim but maybe a firmware problem in which Dell has the Axim booting with a PXBus of 100 and not switching the PXA255 processors over to the normal PXBus speed of 200.

Perhaps this is linked to the "firmware bug" that Dell is currently wrestling with? Why is the axim running the PXBus at 100 by default when it can clearly use the PXBus at 200? (according to the Intel documentation, a motherboard redesign is not necessary to run the PXA255 at an internal bus speed of 200... which is demonstrated by being able to run the Axim with a PXBus of 200). Is CPUID wrong or what's up?

Any thoughts or comments would really be appreciated.

-JmE-

chog

Is this on the new MM2003 or on PPC 2002?

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JmE

On PPC 2002... but if the information I am seeing is correct, it could be in the firmware and carried over to 2003. It would mean that the stock PXA255 Axims out there are running the internal bus at half the speed they should be! I think this is a real important thing if correct.

It appears to me that Dell has it set up to run with the wrong setting (L=27 M=2 N=2) instead of the Intel correct setting of (L=27 M=4 N=1).

What do you think?

Right now I have my Axim running at 400 MHZ (398) with the internal bus where it should be, 200 MHZ (199) and it is running smoother than it ever has with PPC2002.


-JmE-

PDANewbie

But if that were the case what would cause the 03 to run a lot slower than the 02? If both were using the same settings...

chog

Are you using 2002 or 2003 JmE??

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JmE

I am just speculating there, but 2003 is designed to utilize the Xscale more fully, right? What if you cut the internal bus speed of that Xscale in half? Lousy performance!

The PXA250 processor has an internal bus speed of 100 anyway and people were saying they did not see much of a difference between PXA255 PPC 2002 and PXA250 PPC2002. Well, if this default Axim setting is correct, then they would not see much of a difference!

My point is that those of us running Axims with a PXA255 stock might be running it at half the internal bus speed for no good reason.

-JmE-

JmE

Quote:

Originally posted by chog Are you using 2002 or 2003 JmE??

2002

-JmE-

JmE

Here is how anyone can check...

Go to http://www.pocketpccity.com/software...-pocketpc.html and download CPUID.

Copy it to your Axim.

Make sure all overclocking software is turned off.

Run CPUID and check the PXBus line in the results. Please let me know what speed it has there and what the L, M, N values are returned (L will probably be 1, I think a difference in CPUID and the rest of the world).

If you have a PXA255 and the Axim is setting itself correctly, the PXBus should be 199 MHZ if not, it will be 99 MHZ.

Please post here when you try it.

Thanks,

-JmE-

JmE

CPUID apparently also runs in 2003 as Planet-II had posted some screen shots from an HP 2215.

I am curious if someone with 2003 could run CPUID and post the PXBus result and the L, M, N values here.

Please?

-JmE-

chog

Mine says 99mhz bus frequency and L-1 M=2 and N=4

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steelvulture

I have 2003. CPUID says the same thing as chog.

JmE

Yep, that is what my stock Axim had. I used Pocket Hackmaster to set it where it should be per Intel (by way of cageyjames ;) ) of m=4, n=1 and CPUID produces results identical to the HP 2215. I am ignoring the L beacuase I think CPUID is using a different scale or something (L=27 is default and normal with Pocket Hackmaster).

When I set mine to m=4, L=1 PPC2002 became really smooth.

Steelvulture, do you want to set yours at (L=27) M=4, N=1 and post about how PPC2003 runs and what CPUID shows?

-JmE-

JmE

In this thread http://www.aximsite.com/boards/showt...1&goto=newpost about half way down on the first page (I think) you can see the screenshot of CPUID on an HP 2215 with a stock PXBUS of 199 MHZ.

Please don't post replies to this thread there as we had gotten a little off topic in the other thread and I don't want to create duplicate threads.

-JmE-

Astounded EEG

L=1 M=2 N=4

dan12

My Axim basic (WM2003)(PXA255 of course) says L=1, M=2, N=3. I don't know if I want to try overclocking, but I would if that's not how it is supposed to be, hope Dell remembers to look at that while working on their fix.

JmE

Is anyone bothered by the PXBus reading at 99 MHZ yet?

I checked with Anton earlier today and he suggested using the fetch function of his Pocket Hackmaster. I did and it confirmed what CPUID was showing.

Does it look like the Axim defaults to 99 MHZ instead of the 199 MHZ the PXA255 should be or is it a problem with CPUID?

-JmE-

Astounded EEG

is there an implied fix here? just change the LMN settings to something else?

JmE

I changed mine to L=27 (which it is already) M=4 and N=1 in Pocket Hackmaster. Then CPUID shows the same as the HP 2210: PXBus 199 MHZ, L=1 M=3 N=2 (I think, at least whatever Planet II posted in the other thread for his 2215).

I don't have any other fix. Indeed, I was suprised that this has not come up before. If the PXBus is running at half speed and has been since the PXA255 was put in Axims, I would think it should be a big thing, right?

The problem for me is that unless it can be confirmed and word get around, Dell won't even know about it!

I wonder if there is a registry key I can change to hard set the default values???

-JmE-

Astounded EEG

where can i get pocket hackmaster? is it in ppc city? i saw a post somewhere saying it wasn't free....

JmE

I think Xscalular is free. I will check it out on Pocketgear.com and post here.

If you want to look at Pocket Hackmaster, you can go to http://www.pockethackmaster.com and there are links for Palmgear and Handango.

I am not proficient enough with Pocket Hackmaster to get it to scale the way I want with the faster bus. I know it is me, not the overclocking software. I can hard set it for the right speed, but can't seem to set it correctly fo scaling with CPU load.

Also, I think the trial version of Pocket Hackmaster may not let you enter the manual values.

-JmE-

JmE

I must have been thinking of Turbotray as the freeware one. I can't seem to find it on the web and I am not sure it would run under 2003.

I am pretty sure Pocket Hackmaster does run under 2003 and I know you can clock the PXBus to the correct speed with it.

Sorry I couldn't find a free one.

-JmE-

JmE

Anton replied that it looks like Dell did not update the initialization for the CPU when they changed CPUs to the PXA255.

That means that the PXA255 Axims (including those running WM2003) are running slower than they need to be. Stock Axims are running like PXA250...

I am suprised others are not in this thread posting!

The link to Anton's reply is at http://antontomov.com/cgi-bin/ikonbo...r=1;&#entry264

-JmE-

cageyjames

Very interesting.... I'm amazed at this finding. How can this be true?

shmobile

My PXA255 is also showing PXbus = 99MHz. Since I'm running PPC2002, I don't have any noticable problems, and I would have never known about a performance problem since my previous PDA was a Jornada 430se, and there is no comparison between the two.

So, what's the best way to fix this problem?

Sean

JmE

Currently, I am using Pocket Hack Master...

I would really like to confirm it and get the info to Dell so they can issue a patch for those of us running PPC2002.

If anyone knows how to set the Scale settings on Pocket Hack Master so that the 200 MHZ PXBus is being used for the normal speed and up I would really appreciate the help.

-JmE-

HighPlainsD

I dont think you guys are correct. When you are in Normal or power save mode, the PX Bus Frequency is 99 mhz, but when you change to maximum performance mode, the PX Bus frequency is at 199 Mhz, and the performance still sucks. Im running a new 400 Axim with 2003.

JmE

I hope I am wrong!

However, whenever I set my Axim to run even at 400 MHZ (Normal) both CPUID and Pocket Hack Master report the PXBus as running at only 99 MHZ. It only runs at the correct 199 MHZ when it is forced to by 3rd party software.

That is with the Axim running at full speed default!

Please, I hope I am incorrect. Please someone prove or disprove this as it is annoying thinking I have to use software to get my PXA255 running where it should be to begin with!

-JmE-

XKalibuR

at 472mhz i get bus speed 200. but the ipaq & axim have the same external bus 100mhz.

jarget

My Axim says PXA250/B2 Is that the same?

JmE

Quote:

Originally posted by XKalibuR at 472mhz i get bus speed 200. but the ipaq & axim have the same external bus 100mhz.

Correct. They both should have and internal bus speed of 200 MHZ (199) and an external bus speed of 100 (99) by default. But the Axim does not seem to be doing so.

If you set your values manually to L=27 M=4 N=1 you can see the Axim running at the proper setting of 200 MHZ (199) internally and 100 MHZ (99) externally just like the 2215. The Axim should be doing this without any 3rd party software but it does not seem to be doing so.

-JmE-

JmE

Quote:

Originally posted by jarget My Axim says PXA250/B2 Is that the same?

No, that is the older processor. It should be running an internal and external bus speed of 100 MHZ (99). The newer processors (PXA255 aka PXA250C1) should not default to this.

-JmE-

AxiMonkey

This is one hell of a discovery and definitely needs some attention....a move to the aximsite.com index page, duplication in the tell Dell forum, a pin to the top.....something.
Mods?

__________________
Current setup:
Axim X5 Advanced
256 meg SanDisk SD
256 meg Memorex SD
Linksys WCF12 CF Wireless card
Targus 56k Pocket Modem
WriteSHIELD screen protectors
Grindergear Basecamp case
Rhinoskin Aluminum case
Rhinoskin Leather case
Seidio USB Travel Kit
Boxwave Mini-sync cable

_______________________________
AxiMonkey--because AxiChimp just doesn't sound right.

HighPlainsD

If you set your axim to maximium performance in the Power App, and look at the bus speed with CPUID what do you see? I see 199 MHz and Im not using third party. I

AxiMonkey

I just set mine to Normal and it comes back at 99Mhz.

__________________
Current setup:
Axim X5 Advanced
256 meg SanDisk SD
256 meg Memorex SD
Linksys WCF12 CF Wireless card
Targus 56k Pocket Modem
WriteSHIELD screen protectors
Grindergear Basecamp case
Rhinoskin Aluminum case
Rhinoskin Leather case
Seidio USB Travel Kit
Boxwave Mini-sync cable

_______________________________
AxiMonkey--because AxiChimp just doesn't sound right.

AxiMonkey

HighPlains,

Are you talking about your Run Mode Frequency or your PXbus Frequency. We're all talking about PXbus frequency. I ask because my run mode frequency is also 199Mhz and wanted to make sure you were on the same page.

__________________
Current setup:
Axim X5 Advanced
256 meg SanDisk SD
256 meg Memorex SD
Linksys WCF12 CF Wireless card
Targus 56k Pocket Modem
WriteSHIELD screen protectors
Grindergear Basecamp case
Rhinoskin Aluminum case
Rhinoskin Leather case
Seidio USB Travel Kit
Boxwave Mini-sync cable

_______________________________
AxiMonkey--because AxiChimp just doesn't sound right.

jarget

Thanks Jme

whitelyt

I have loaded CPUID on my Axim. This is what I had reported:

CPU: PXA255
CPU Current Frequency: 398MHz
Current Mode: Turbo
.....
.....
PXbus Frequency: 99MHz
SDRAM max Frequency: 99 MHz
.....
.....
L=1 M=2 N=4

JmE

Anton recommended I check out the PXBus setting with 2.41beta version of Pocket Hack Master. I will be checking it out shortly and will post.

-JmE-

whitelyt

Forgot,

I am running PPC2002.

I have loaded CPUID on my Axim. This is what I had reported:

CPU: PXA255
CPU Current Frequency: 398MHz
Current Mode: Turbo
.....
.....
PXbus Frequency: 99MHz
SDRAM max Frequency: 99 MHz
.....
.....
L=1 M=2 N=4

HighPlainsD

I am looking at PXBus Frequency = 199mHz

L=1 M=3 N=2

Im in Run Mode and I have Maximum Performance set