... ... power: face it umpc's is what will replace the traditional pda. power of a computer @ the size of a pda or slightly larger. palmos and winmob is just too weak when there's a comparable sized machine running full xp. ...
That may be the case for some - but not me. The PDA is the perfect-sized carry-around. A umpc might have some "cool" factor to it - but if I'm going to go with a device approaching that size then it's going to have a keyboard and a clamshell design. I think they call that a "notebook".
Come to think of it - I have a little ThinkPad which is darn close to being as small as a umpc when the lid is closed. (E-300 I think). I mean - it's really small and light, yet it runs XP-Professional and has a 40GB hard drive and 256MB of memory. I can't see going to a umpc from there.
For a male that doesn't always carry a briefcase, the UMPC won't work as well. A PDA can fit in a pocket or maybe clip to your belt, but the UMPC will probably require some sort of case. I might like the UMPC also but it wouldn't replace all of the functions of a PDA, but maybe a PDA phone plus a UMPC would work. I'm not sure I can replace my PDA use with any phone that is likely to be available.
I remember some years ago when laptop computers were shrinking. They were called "laptop" because they were fairly large. As they became smaller they became "notebook" computers because they could fit in a notebook, or fit in a briefcase along with your other papers. Notebooks were actually getting to be the size of 8.5" x 11" paper, and 1-2" thick. There were also "subnotebooks" that were maybe 7" x 11", but these went away pretty quickly. I think the average buyer decided they liked larger screens and they weren't business travelers so they didn't care about fitting the computer in a briefcase. I'm not sure my Dell Inspiron would even fit in my briefcase. I had to hunt around and buy a special case for it. I think personally I might like a smaller notebook, or even a UMPC, for my own use since it is a little easier to carry around.
UMPCs wont be able to come out for a looong time that can actually be in ur pocket.......
1. heat issues.....an x64 processor that can run windows xp (even less vista) generates far too much heat to be in such a thing. 65nm technology is good but not that good......the intel core 2 processors lead the industry.......but they still need heatsinks
2. power....to run the GPU and CPU and memory and all that stuff needs a huge pack of juice so that is gonna be big
3 fragility.......with current stuff, dont expect the heavy chunk of metal to be alright if dropped on the floor
4. weight........the darn things are HUGE and HEAVY 3lbs usually
i think pdas will be around for a long time until we get to like 45nm tech at 2010 or somethin
Well, if all I wanted was a multimedia machine with some PIM functionality I wouldn't buy an Axim. With an extended battery slapped to its rear, next to iPod it looks like a pregnant hippo.
As a business user, I can't use it as much as I'd love to because it's really underpowered compared to a laptop. Try working on a 3.5 mb excel spreadsheet loaded with macros and formulas. Even if you use software that can handle excel macros it crawls. And the screen real estate is minimal. What it's really good for, other than being a PIM, is a "quickie" work on a document, notetaking, small stuff. I love PDAs and I like Axim but they are indeed a niche market.
Do people think Smartphones are a niche market?
Can anybody tell me why an Smartphone (WindowsMobile) is not considered a PocketPc + Phone?
I think people are getting out of the point of this thread. The idea is that marketing campaigns on PocketPcs talk about it being a PIM where you can
view some documents. They never focus on the multimedia capacities (Media Player) when they have better screens and processors than other PMP.
And you are not restricted to a specific video/music format with the right software (TCMP/Betaplayer). And you can have email (FlexMail),surf the net (Opera,NetFront), VoIp (Skype), Messenger,GPS and anything you find the software to do it, even Games. If people knew all of this, maybe it wouldn't be a niche market.
It is NOT just a PIM.
Do people think Smartphones are a niche market?
Can anybody tell me why an Smartphone (WindowsMobile) is not considered a PocketPc + Phone?
I see too many of them and too many new ones coming out to thing Smartphones are a niche market. I think the take of most of the Axim junkies (like me) on this site is that Smartphones generally have slower processors and smaller screens. We'd call it Phone + PocketPcLite.
US to Zambia and no battery problems??? I'd beg to differ. My Ipod video's battery last about 4 hours, MAYBE 5. Yeah that may be longer than my Axim, but atleast I can pop another battery in the back when needed.
About Smartphones. If Dell was to make an Axim X60 kind of smartphone and marketing and price was good it would be a great selling product. Something like the Qtek/HTC smartphones.
On of the main cons of PPC is the memory..but flash memory prices fall down so quick!In 2 years will have 8Gb SD for 80$ probably. Faster processor for the same price of todays one (1Ghz?). Then what is left is the battery issue.
If you had big memory and long battery life would you still consider buying an Ipod /Zune (or other PMP) for the same price? I wouldn't.
oh yea.....by the time UMPCs get advanced enough to run XP there will be a new standard in the market and they wont be powerful enough to handle that standard.......without going back to the issues i mentioned
i dont think they will make it well in the market......just stick with a pda and laptop.....unless you like carrying funny looking tech and almost getting roadkill from not paying attention while walking (the only reason i could think of for having one is to use while walking)
Maybe this has been said already, but with the price of smart phones and laptops coming down so dramatically, and the way pda manufacturers are marketing their devices, it's a wonder that there are any pda's bought at all. I mentioned this several times on the site that you really can't find an Axim on any print ad media, and you really have to look hard to find one at a Dell kiosk in the mall. Maybe Dell will go the phone route, but I doubt it. I still contend they can make more money off of the pc's and laptops, what with the accessories and peripherals. For them, the Axim is a $350 item and then out. The only thing they get in return after that, is the complaints from Axim users that their hardware or software isn't working. Enough said!
Lack of adequate marketing certainly is a factor, but lack of new devices w/o phones is also a major factor (if not a larger factor). Convergence works for some, but market does not recognize there are many who wish PPC separate from phone. In the old days we could get a receiver (tuner/amp) or a separate tuner & amp and you could choose the option you want. Now if you want to buy a new non-phone PPC the x51v is one of very few options available.
X30 gave me infinite expectations for future of PPC platform. The last generation of top PPC’s (Loox720, x51/50, Hp4700, etc.) were close to perfect but each seemed to have at least one “fatal flaw” & competition between 4 models was so fierce that for all but Dell the lines were not as profitable as hoped or needed for follow-on devices to be made. I finally broke down & got an x51v, [not nearly as thrilled as after getting X30]. In addition, I bought another x30 on e-bay (which is a purchase process I despise [if you think Dell sales & tech support is bad then e-bay is true hell], but was forced to go through because in my opinion Dell stopped making x30’s way too soon).
I hope Dell makes a converged device for those who want one so badly, but I much more hope that they (or at least one other manufacturer) make(s) at least one follow-on stand alone PPC device. If the only way I can get a PDA in the future is to get a phone device then the x51 will be the last PDA I own. Again if you think Dell’s PDA support is bad wait until you see the pathetic support most (if not all) cell phone companies offer! Getting a full featured phone you want that works well as a phone and finding a carrier you want that offers such a phone is like winning the lottery. Trying to get a PDA/phone combo with what you want and the carrier you want is like winning the lottery on 5 tickets in a row. I like the odds much better for getting a PDA only.
Finally, IMHO the “over glorified”, much touted everywhere access data for converged devices is a bunch of baloney. For the prices most cell carriers charge for PDA data plans I will never purchase one and as such the convergence feature is useless. I can see a big price for the unlimited plans, but for casual user’s again IMO the data prices are ludicrous (the voice plan equivalent of today’s data plans must be something like $60 for 10 minutes of anytime calls). At current prices there is no internet info that I need so urgently that I can’t wait until I’m at work, at home or near a WiFi access point.
In summary it seems a combination of inadequate marketing, convergence, lack of new devices and ridiculous data prices is what is really killing the PDA market. Note that competition from iPod’s is not helping. Many iPod user’s do not want and/or cannot handle the added complexity (or cost) required to keep a PPC going.
May the stand alone PPC somehow rise back from the dead!
Also I agree with zoeydanielle, the profit potential ain't there for the PDA.
Just thought I'd defend the axim as a multimedia unit a little bit here since I think it is taking some unfair bashing.
Last August I flew a non-stop flight from Chicago to Japan and back, a 14 hour flight each way. On that first flight I watched TWO full length movies at a decent resolution. Listened to about 4 hours of music. And played videogames for about an hour. I did this all on a Mugen 3300 battery and when the plane landed I STILL had 20% of my battery life left! I don't know if I am a freak case but I honestly can not ask for a better entertainment system then my x50v.
Most people still don't understand PDA's. I had an argument with a coworker yesterday about the benefits of a PDA. He still thinks you just keep a list of phone numbers in it.
I find it interesting that PDA's are losing in popularity but they are still hotly contested on ebay. I've been trying to buy a replacement for my X5 and the used units on ebay, even 4 or 5 year old units such as the hp h1910, go for pretty good prices. My X5 still works perfectly, it just doesn't have a few features that I would like to have. So at least we can have faith that used but fully useful units will be available for a good period of time.
I think it would be great if Dell just made an X51V that actually worked. (The problems documented in our own forums here are horrendous.)
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