"real VGA" is not REAL VGA?? It is expanded???

criticism · 02-09-05, 04:11 PM

Hi. I have an x50v and I'm very confused by some of the posts around here.

First, this whole post is based on the assumption that the x50v ships with the vga screen settings (640x480) as default. If this is incorrect and qvga (320x240) is actually the default on the x50v, please let me know.

Now, it seems that there are programs that allow you to modify the screen resolution, similar to modifying the screen resolutions under the display settings in windows. One example of this program is SE VGA. These programs are only necessary because the operating system on the pocket pc doesnt provide you with an option to modify these settings.

Now, on the site I linked to, the description says "This application enable (sic) a Pocket PC with VGA display runing WM2003SE to run in what I call "real VGA" mode"

But isnt "real VGA" just some term the software writer is making up? Would it have been more accurate to call it "beyond VGA" or something else that conveys the point that the program is making it possible for you to use the device at screen resolution higher than rael 640x480 VGA???

I think that calling this function is probably very careless and also stupid, as it has led to a lot of confusion about what REAL VGA actually is. As I understand it, the program is not making it possible to use the device in VGA (640x480) screen resoluation but at resolutions beyond 640x480.

Given this, REAL VGA is actually the default, and SE VGA and similar programs allow you to use the program at resolutions higher than the native 640x480 VGA resolution. Correct?

Thank you very much for helping me understand this. I have been quite confused in my reading of this forum.

d0pefish · 02-09-05, 04:16 PM

The resolution of the display as a whole never changes, its the interface that changes with these patches, I think.

Whats special about the X50v and other VGA PDAs is that the interface is shown at twice the size of standard PDAs (by standard) but in the same amount of physical space; hence everything looks cleaner and smoother as there are twice the number of pixels displayed on screen.

These patches put the interface back down to the original size, but because the X50V has a higher resolution screen, you appear to have more space, and everything looks "smaller" :)

criticism · 02-09-05, 04:18 PM

So, SE VGA and similar programs allow you to view your screen at display resolutions higher than VGA 640x480?

d0pefish · 02-09-05, 04:21 PM

Originally Posted by criticism

So, SE VGA and similar programs allow you to view your screen at display resolutions higher than VGA 640x480?

No, only the size of the interface (i.e. taskbar, buttons, fonts) are changing, back to the original "QVGA size", but displayed on the VGA screen, they look smaller and you have more space onscreen.

It's hard to explain, I'm sorry... maybe someone else can explain in a clearer way? :)

d0pefish · 02-09-05, 04:30 PM

Maybe this helps to explain - (Sorry for large images!!)

This is a standard PDA; QVGA - 240x320:

This is a VGA PDA; - 480x640:

This is a VGA PDA with SE VGA patch:

Does that help? The image sizes are a little off, I couldnt find any better screenshots :(

anodos · 02-09-05, 04:42 PM

Basically, the way X50v implements VGA (its 640x480 pixels) is to make everything look the same size as if it were on a QVGA screen (320x240) of the same physical size. So, they double the size of fonts, double the size of icons, double the size of lines, double the size of everything! Because this is confusing, let me clarify my term. By "double the size", I mean that they draw these things at twice the resolution so that in the end it remains the same PHYSICAL size, but looks smoother. Think of it this way. If you have two PDAs with screens of the exact same physical size but one is VGA and the other QVGA, then the VGA screen's pixels would be 1/4 the physical size of the QVGA pixels (half the size vertically + half the size horizontally = 1/4 the size total). They realize that PDA screens tend to be small and Microsoft wants to be sure that these things are readable by the average person, so they want to keep the physical size of fonts and icons the same. Their goal is to make things look the same size physically, even though you have twice (or 4 times if you add vertical and horizontal together) the resolution. This mostly makes things look smoother (especially fonts) because they are drawn at twice the resolution. If the letter A were drawn 10 pixels wide on the QVGA screen, for example, then it would be drawn 20 pixels wide on the VGA screen, giving the OS lots of extra pixels to make the letter A look really smooth and nice, though keeping the actual real-world physical dimensions of the letter A the same between both screens.
Yes, "real VGA" can be a little misleading. What it really does is simply tell Windows Mobile to draw everything using the same number of pixels as on a QVGA screen. In other words, if you drew it using 4 pixels on a QVGA screen, then draw it using 4 pixels on the VGA screen. Of course, as I explained, Windows Mobile would normally automatically double the number on the VGA screen and draw it in 8 pixels so that it would look the same size physically. This has the end effect of making everything look 4 times smaller, since the VGA screen's pixels are 4 times smaller, even though it is all done in the same 640x480 screen. If this is still confusing, let me know and I'll do my best to explain in more detail. :)

- Anodos

d0pefish · 02-09-05, 04:48 PM

Thats better :)

Oh god, i just realised that it's 4 times the size. Sorry

I'm terrible at logical stuff like that, but thats what I meant! :) I just said it wrong.

Morph27 · 02-09-05, 05:00 PM

Hey criticism,

:approve: Good Question.
Personally I have been using the SE_VGA mode for the past month that I've had my x50v. But just wanted to say. Good question to ask. Was nice to see the answers

Josh

ssampath · 02-09-05, 05:04 PM

I am confused about this as well - it seems like applications
like PIE already display in native VGA mode right ? There should
be no difference if you are in the normal mode or real VGA mode ?
Just using the smallest font in native mode is like using the
largest font in real VGA mode ?

That is what it seems like to me when I tried ozVga and se_vga.

Thanks

sam

ValkyrieRider · 02-09-05, 05:17 PM

Originally Posted by ssampath

I am confused about this as well - it seems like applications
like PIE already display in native VGA mode right ? There should
be no difference if you are in the normal mode or real VGA mode ?
Just using the smallest font in native mode is like using the
largest font in real VGA mode ?

That is what it seems like to me when I tried ozVga and se_vga.

Thanks

sam

You're forgetting about images. The major difference when using se_vga (and/or oz_vga) when displaying graphics is that the graphics take up much less screen real estate. This is VERY useful when using PIE, as it makes more of the screen visible without having to scroll as much.

ssampath · 02-09-05, 05:20 PM

Originally Posted by ValkyrieRider

You're forgetting about images. The major difference when using se_vga (and/or oz_vga) when displaying graphics is that the graphics take up much less screen real estate. This is VERY useful when using PIE, as it makes more of the screen visible without having to scroll as much.

Does the brute force method work with PIE ?

I was using real VGA for a while but so many programs have
problems with it that I gave up on it and I really do not like
switching in and out of real VGA mode.

Thanks

sam