Is there an agreement that comes with the wm5 sdk?
No but the MSDN site explains all of it the mods need to do some background work before making decisions and need to be consistent.
Instead of just discussing this maybe they should block the hp threads or unblock the Dell threads until they have a solution. Maybe they should even block the age old Widcomm thread since that seems to fall under their blocking authority.
I've been emailing Chris about the situation as is.
ok, I'm confused now... Is the Dell rom just WM05 upgraded? I was under the impression it was WM06...?
I have an idea of why the thread was banned, though it applies to the HP rom too. I suspect it has to do with reverse-engineering, which IS illegal. This is why everyone LOVES the GNU GPL - it's a lisence that allows you to alter it and rewrite it and everything else! However, if oyu look in your lisencing agreement, I'm willing to bet there's al ine about "I agree not to reverse enginere [WM05]" and THAT is what's illegal. If he were just passing out homebrew roms that uses the default WM05 image and added freeware themes or something, it's fine, but reverse-engineering the OS is where hte problem comes.
on the side, I love the idea of building your own rom and flashing a security program into it so it's useless if stolen! that's golden!
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Last edited by Ashton; 07-06-07 at 07:35 PM.
Reason: elaborated
users of wm5 capable machines can add to and take away what they like from the rom as they have purchased a licensed copy, can't we all do that with XP or Vista? make them suit our needs? made our own drivers etc? So long as we do not infringe on the copyright of others by adding in warez then it should be legal... only X50/v users should be able to use the Widcomm stack as that is what is available to them initially and they should be free to 'move' the bluetooth drivers to WM5 without infringing on copyright as they own the right to use them, unlike X51/v users.
But how does chris police all that? He can't so realistically the best way to stop himself coming under fire would be to ban hacks... or have set thread and ban the people who ask about having Widcomm on there X51v or Wanting to have or trying to have WM6 on their machine if its illegal
I just wanted to point out something. So many poeple are arguing that we ahve a right to this rom because we paid for WM05 (some of us paid for multiple coppies...) and yes, this does entitle us to updates, and yes, dell should have the decentcy to say "we will support updates through the release of WM06" or something, and should keep churning out roms for every major fix --- or find a way to make a patch.
When we talk about updating our ROM, that's the same as taking windows XP and reformatting and reinstalling. (better example: going form NT to 2K to XP, since they're all NT, NT 5 and NT 6) That's not the same as simply patching the install. Yes, if MS were to release a patch that was not device-specific, then we would have a right to download it and if it was withheld from us we could rightly argue that they need to turn it over. However, a whole rom is another story. While, as I said above, I think Dell shoudl see this through and release roms for major improvements, such as AKU 3, they have not agreed to, and as such we havn't got a legal leg to stand on to demand it. The most we coudl do is set up a petition to force dell to continue updates, or contact MS (if anyone acctually thinks that would do any good...)
My personal stance on the issue, though: If dell refuses to release new updates, and MS doesnt care, then I say let the hackers toil towards a goal. Hell, if MS doesnt care let them port WM06 and even WM07 to X51v! But, even if you throw this off the site, it's still over on XDA developers, and atleast 10 other sites I found when I googled the ROM AKU version... You cant stop piracy, and if you try, that only makes it worse...
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Blackberry 7510 + operamini + $10 boost mobile = unlimited internet on BB w/o $40 BIS plan! (no email though)
But they aren't reverse engineering anything, they are providing an update to a ROM that Dell should have provided under our WM5 license agreement and they haven't done that. These hacked ROMs only provide something that we already own, but haven't received from Dell, just like the Widcomm hack, does. IT provides the Bluetooth drivers that we paid for, but didn't recieve.
I personally paid for my WM5 license twice with the upgrade for the x50v and the x51v and definitely want the advantage of full upgradability.
Like noisycrow has stated, there is internal discussion as well as phone calls being made at this time. Gray areas should not be rushed, give me time to review everything.
ps. I found an email in my spam box from someone in this thread, I will let this post acknowledge it's receipt.
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Okay, some people seem a little confused on why it's illegal. If you also happen to own a PSP and know about DarkAlex, he's leaving the community for fear of the same reason.
When you use a product, you agree to the license agreements. In most license agreements for software, they specifically state that you cannot reverse engineer, modify the software provided in anyway at all. That includes then distributing the said software. Its the owner's IP and even if you think its unfair- those are the guidelines. If you don't agree with that then you're told to return/not use the device.
Even if a custom job seems a lot better, under the license agreement you've accepted- it's prohibited and in terms of illegality- it overlaps with copyright issues.
hacking ROMs are the same thing as reverse engineering. You're looking at the code and modifying it.
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Last edited by currahee2100; 07-07-07 at 12:31 AM.
The AKU 3.5 is just an upgrade perfectly legal by all respects.
But yes by adding or taking away certain features that aren't suppose to be in it he is doing something illegal. Or by trying to develop WM6.
Well I for one am seriously thinking of going back to my tungsten e2. I bought my axim in a fit of anger after Palm wanted $199 to fix a product I could replace for very little more. My axim cost a little more than $350 and I had many good experiences with Dell. I ended up fixing the Palm myself thanks to a forum like this one.
Don't get me wrong, the hardware of my Axim is superior as is the fact that I can get an extended waranty like I can get for my laptops and desktops. I have over ten computers in this house and more that I have either donated to my kids school and given away to friends, But I am sick and tired of Microsoft and their practices and products
My Axim has to be soft reset so many times in just one day that I stopped keeping count. The first couple Palms I had didn't even include a tool to reset them, you had to hunt for a small enough paper clip.
I have hard reset the thing so often I keep a list of my cab files on my web site and a spare flash card. I install all my programs into very rigidly organized folders and back up the links from the windows start up folder so I can paste them back each time.
Windows XP 98, ME (shudder) and vista (gasp) are even worse. Compaq said once that since ME wasn't ready they would install 98 and give me a coupon for ME. They lied. When the in inevitable problems arose and the OS disk was not included, the idiot in tech support told me that they had set it up to reinstall from the web site. DUH, my problem was that I couldn't connect. And of course I couldn't roll back to 98 either. I once had to reboot 20 time in order to get windows ME to start up. The computer is still working with a purchased copy of XP but will soon have linux put on it.
I've even posted on the mobility site forum that I don't see what the fuss is about hard resetting the axim. I've never been the same since the weekend that I had to reinstall XP on 5 pcs in one weekend
Sorry about the rant but I have been up all night trying to fix a problem on my axim with CF.net v1 sp3 and cf.net 2. It seems some software needs one but other software needs the other.
So do I want a new ROM version? heck no, but I blame Microsoft not Dell for whatever agreement that made Dell responsible for the updates instead of MS. DO I blame Dell for dropping the Axim? No. Do I like it? No. You can still get Hand helds from Dell though. I don't know how good they are.
I also don't like the fact that you can't use Active sync on a Mac. Do I want an IPhone? No. I don't carry my cell as it is. But I have a sneaky suspicion that Apple made it easy to "hack" on purpose. ATT had something Apple needed, The exclusivity benefited ATT more than it did Apple.
So rather than blame the mods for watching their backs, put the blame with MS for making the updates hard to get.
This again is just the opinion of a sleep deprived aspie. (Aspergers syndrome - a condition on the autism spectrum ) We tend to say what we think. No offence intended to anyone here. You all have been a godsend.
Play hard and bounce high
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We get old because we stop playing
The license to use Windows Mobile is per user (has any admin or mod actually read the license that came with their Axim?).
Thus, whether you used the one Dell provided or a hacked one found on the web, as long as you bought your Axim (as they all come with a WM5 license) then it is perfectly legal.
It is only ILLEGAL if you do not own a Windows Mobile device (and thus license) but you use the ROM anyway (even though not possible, I think).
It is exactly the same situation with game and emulator ROMs - it is legal to download and play them as long as you own the original on a DVD or cartridge as the game is also licensed per user and not per media. However, it becomes illegal to download and use these ROMs if you *don't* own an original.
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